Avery – 00:01

Hi, I’m Avery Thatcher, a former ICU nurse, and this is not your standard stress management podcast where we just focus on those band-aid solutions like the benefits of meditation, mindfulness, and self-care.

You already know that you need some kind of recovery strategy to deal with your stressful life, but what you may not know Are all of the sneaky ways that society, our upbringing and our high achieving nature and so many other factors contribute to our risk of burnout.

That my friend is what we talk about here on this podcast because you can’t do something about a situation that you’re not aware of right?

So if you’re ready to get out of the pattern of burning out, feeling better only to burn out again, it’s time for us to shut the light on the truth about burnout.

All right, so I’m excited to chat with Leanne today because we met through another connection.

I think somebody else introduced us and it led to a lot of really interesting conversations and I’m excited for you to come on and share your story today.

So thanks for joining me.

Avery – 01:05

Thank you for having me.

I’m excited to be here.

Yes, so typically we talk to people that identify as high achievers and even though you wouldn’t use that word to describe yourself, you do display a lot of the characteristics.

There’s a lot of internal pressure, a lot of strive for as close to perfect as we can get.

So tell us a little bit about you and your story and what kind of set you up for that burnout experience.

Leanne – 01:33

I think as far as high achiever, it’s specialized high achiever.

For one area, I was trying to be the best, where everything else didn’t seem as perfect or I didn’t really care as much, so I just let it fall aside.

I didn’t think of myself as a high achiever because those things definitely weren’t perfect.

So it’s more just like tunnel vision on what I wanted to be perfect at or what I felt the pressure to be perfect at.

And what was that?

Being a mom, that was my thing.

As soon as I got pregnant, I always wanted to be a mom.

Leanne – 02:09

So it’s always something I knew I wanted to be.

Even though society, family always tells you should be a mom, I actually felt inside that I really wanted to be.

That pressure didn’t really bother me growing up because it’s something that I always knew I wanted.

I didn’t know why, but it was just there.

So when I got pregnant with my oldest, who’s now 12, I didn’t know what to expect.

But you just have this picture in your mind of what you see around with your family, your friends, TV, of what you think it should be, and it was not that at all.

It was completely… my idea of how it was going to happen was completely different.

Leanne – 02:54

So, my first introduction, I didn’t really know what… For me, when I look back, it feels like I completely lost myself.

Like, everything that was me was gone, was just ripped away in a day and I was now a mom and I knew Nothing.

I had tons of expectations of myself and other people around me and it felt like everything was now about her, nothing was about me.

So it was complete loss of identity as well as I had to be the best and The first year was extremely difficult because she, looking back now it makes sense because she’s been diagnosed with autism and ADHD and Tourette’s syndrome and anxiety and lots of allergies when she was younger, so she was not

an easygoing baby, to say the least.

She didn’t sleep and I was completely tunnel vision onto her and It is what it is.

I feel like that was something I needed to go through in order to be who I am now, but it was extremely difficult that I didn’t know what I didn’t know my value and I didn’t know what I needed to do to bring into, like, for one example, like, my mom never took a break, she never went on date

Leanne – 04:23

nights, she never did anything for herself without taking at least a kid with her.

So I never, I didn’t see anybody taking time for themselves.

I think the first time I was away from her, it was for like two hours and she was like seven months and that was… I felt so much guilt.

I didn’t release or be able to do anything without guilt until like… my oldest would have been about five.

So that’s a long time of being guilty every time that you’re away from your kid.

So that really brought a lot of internal pressure and external pressure kind of combined.

But I also felt like that idea of like your kids being perfect and your kids being a reflection of you And having that pressure to behave in a way that society wants them to behave and my kids cannot do that.

Leanne – 05:29

It’s not a realistic expectation for them to do that.

You can’t have normal, I’m gonna say normal in quotation marks, expectations on neurodiverse kids or even any kids, really.

Anybody under the age of five Like any expectation goes out the window, you know, like every day, every mood, it changes everything.

So I really internalized and really pushed myself and almost like punished myself and like talking bad things about myself when my kids were acting up and saying that I’m the bad person for this happening.

I wasn’t seeing it as a neutral thing of this is just happening, I was punishing myself.

And trying to do all the things, do all the baking, doing all like the all the treat days for school and just doing all the perfect things that you see all the parents doing or like you see other people being praised for and then doing it to get the praise because that will make you feel like a

better parent because someone’s saying hey you did a good job.

Leanne – 06:35

And just seeking external instead of internal, I feel like that was a lot of it.

And also, I’m just an anxious person in general.

Since I was growing up, that’s kind of something I carried with me and it really… I feel like… Being able to… trying to control or trying to be the best was the way that my anxiety manifested once I became a mom and I went down that path and eventually I got to the point where I… it came to

physical symptoms.

I was having anxiety attacks Like multiple times a week.

At one point, about a year after the anxiety attack started, I started to get arthritis, like autoimmune arthritis, to the point where I couldn’t braid my kid’s hair, I couldn’t do up buttons.

When I woke up in the morning, it took half an hour to be able to walk, like I had to take hot showers.

Leanne – 07:45

It was not a good existence and it just it’s because I ignored everything.

I kept pushing everything until I had a breaking point and that I could not exist without help and I had to ask for help and once I asked for help from you know a psychiatrist for my anxiety and rheumatologist for my arthritis once everything started going then I think I started to become easier on

myself because I think I needed to have that physical experience in order to justify the internal experience because my whole life, if it’s not physical, it’s not real.

Mental things aren’t real.

That’s kind of what I grew up with and so having it be physical I was able to get help.

Like I didn’t seek help for my anxiety until after my arthritis started bothering me.

So like once it all kind of came together I was able to seek help and for me personally I feel like one of my life lessons is giving up control and asking for help.

Leanne – 08:52

It’s a really hard thing for me and when I do ask for help then things start to flow and things start to come together and that is kind of where things started to get better.

was able to ask more of my husband because I was taking on a lot and I was able to just explain to people what was going on without any sort of preconceived notions.

And I feel like that was the bottom but also the opening.

Like hitting the bottom just opened up the ceiling so I could come out and start exploring and when that happened that also was when I started to dive into spirituality.

I started to become aware, I became aware of it and then I was ready to be interested and start learning and once I started on that path it just kept snowballing and I feel like that was my real Change into healing myself, healing the burnout, not letting that burnout or when stressors start to

come, I stop it or I’m able to let it disperse before it reaches ahead so that I don’t crumble and get to a bottom point again.

It feels like that is my Not only a safeguard, just give me tools.

Leanne – 10:29

The tools to be able to manage it as it comes and to recognize it so that I don’t push myself too hard.

I’m more forgiving of myself because I can, I listen to my body, I listen to my emotions, my feelings, I don’t ignore it and just push it down, push it down, push it down until it’s so loud you can’t ignore it.

I’m able to listen to it a little bit sooner, which I think is the big key, is finding when do you listen and what tools around you can help you manage it.

Either make, I want to say go away, but be able to make it manageable or find This is evening it out a little bit kind of or just being able to know that you can wait it’s okay not to fix it it’s gonna get better just wait or just I guess it more of an inner peace.

Avery – 11:29

Yes exactly you’ve highlighted so many things over all of this and you’ve made it so that you’ve done your own interview like I don’t even have to ask any questions it was beautiful just the arc of what happened there and I was just sitting back being like just doing my job for me this is great.

Leanne – 11:43

I was just like I’ll just keep talking until you tell me not to.

Avery – 11:47

No, it was perfect.

So again, I just want to highlight a couple of things.

You talked about how much of your identity was lost initially in that birth of your first child.

And that is something that I think is really common with a lot of parents, and it’s not something that’s talked about enough.

And in our interview with Jason McCleary, we also talked about that, because he talked about how his identity completely changed with fatherhood.

So I think, again, this is something that we just need to talk about more to be able to normalize some of those feelings so that we can start to support each other in a much more deep way.

So I really just want to honor that you shared that I think that’s so important.

Avery – 12:32

Another thing is with the high achievement it is totally okay for it to be single focused.

Because that is really common especially when we’re early into our burnout phase because we start to say like okay well I’ve got to be good at something like the best at something so I’m going to narrow in on this and just be the go-to person for this and a lot of that then piles

things on and the internal and external expectations and so a lot of what you were sharing there was absolutely part of that journey into the high achiever.

Now you talked about how spirituality was kind of the thing that started to bring you out and then you also shared one of the things that a lot of people often say when I ask them like what was the one thing that You really wish you could go back and tell that version of you and that was to listen

to yourself and to hear what your body is telling you before it starts to say it much louder.

So tell me, friend, what are some of the ways that you can listen to those voices while they’re still quiet?

What kind of hints do you have?

Leanne – 13:42

I think for me the most beneficial thing, because I’m busy, my kids are busy, is to make time every day to have the intention to listen.

Don’t just wait for it to be loud enough because if you’re busy enough you’re not going to hear it.

You’re so focused on other things because that inner voice listening to yourself is quiet.

It’s quiet until it’s loud, all right, and we don’t want it to be loud.

So I take time in the either in the morning usually in the evening after the kids are in bed when the house is quiet I feel the most connected to myself and I Make note of how I’m feeling, sometimes I’ll do journaling.

For me, I do a lot of… closer to like a spiritual practice, like I am a medium and I like connecting to my guides, that helps me a lot.

I feel like connecting to that part of my soul helps me be connected to my physical body.

Avery – 14:51

And so for the person listening and being like well that sounds great but how much time am I supposed to do?

Like how long is this gonna take?

Tell me what does that look like for you?

How long sort of on average does this practice take per day?

Leanne – 15:05

Well I’d say I try to do five minutes and that’s like my goal.

And most of the time, especially if I do it at night time, it’ll go longer because I’m not having fun, I’m enjoying it and I don’t have a time frame and I know my body’s resting, I’m not, I usually do this lying down so that like I know that like if I fall asleep it’s fine and I know that I’m not

busy doing something so even if I’m awake in my mind playing around for a couple hours, I’m still resting so I still count it as part of like Almost sleep, especially since your brain is kind of on a different wavelength, so it kind of works, but I don’t think you have to have any sort of

development level or anything to do this.

I think it’s laying down and I think focusing on your body, like maybe starting at your head or your feet and checking in to see how each part of you feels, if there’s tension there, Saying, hey, what can we do to relax this?

Can we relax this more?

And then playing around.

Leanne – 16:16

And for me, it needs to feel like playing, not a chore.

Avery – 16:22

Yes, okay, yes.

So if you were listening and you were expecting Leanne to say more than five minutes and you were thinking she’d be like, oh, I spent 30 minutes on this, an hour on this, and the five minutes shocked you, That’s a good thing.

Allow that surprise to help cultivate some of that playfulness.

And that’s the other thing which I wanted to chat to you about.

I love that you said you want it to be fun and playful and without expectation.

So does it always work that way for you?

Or do you have times where it feels a little bit more like a chore, but you do it anyway?

Leanne – 16:56

I’d say at this point, no, because I think it’s really fun and I get to do it.

At the beginning, it felt like I had to do it, but it was like I need to do this in order to feel good.

I prioritize the chore.

So I feel like I didn’t have a point where I was like, oh, I don’t want to do this necessarily.

There are times where I forget and it’s not a big deal.

I don’t punish myself for it.

It’s just like, okay, it didn’t happen.

Leanne – 17:28

But I really try.

Let’s say if the kids are really not going to sleep.

And then by the time I’m in bed, I’m just like, I’m done.

I’m just going to sleep.

So be it.

It’s just like, it happens.

But when everybody kind of just goes to bed and you’re just like, hey, this is amazing.

Leanne – 17:45

I’m going to, I’m going to play around in my brain.

I’m going to just, and it can also be, I, this is one thing I’m really kind of passionate about.

It’s just like your intuition or listening to yourself.

It’s just imagination.

You could just lay in bed and just imagine something fun and you can… I find that it also connects you with yourself because in that imagination zone you will eventually get to a place where you kind of… you’re not searching outward, you’re going inward and then you’ll start to notice things

about yourself.

But having something to look forward to like if when I was little I was always imagining I was always pretending in my head I was always making up stories and just kind of sitting in my room and Making stories in my head.

Leanne – 18:39

So for me, that’s fun.

So if someone else thinks imagination or daydreaming is fun, then go more that route.

And if you want something just quick, just checking your body and seeing how it goes would be what I would say to work on.

But Yeah, I feel like the most important thing is that it can’t be hard because I’m so busy and I’ve always been really busy and if it took up a lot of time I don’t want to do it unless I really love it.

If I love it then I’ll spend time on it but if I don’t love it it’s just got to be like easy peasy.

Agreed.

Avery – 19:22

So I love that you provided both of those action steps and made it really easy for the person that maybe identifies as more intuitive and then the person that maybe identifies as more intellectual.

You gave them two brilliant different options there, so thank you for that.

Multiple speakers – 19:35

You’re welcome.

Avery – 19:36

So I think that ties in beautifully to talk a little bit more about what you do now and how you help people now.

I feel like you’re definitely on the intuitive side of that.

Oh man, that’s me, huh?

Leanne – 19:51

So I’m an intuitive medium.

That’s how I kind of came into this spiritual world.

My grandfather started talking to me and I was like, what the heck?

That kind of blew my mind and then I started developing and working with teachers and through there I learned about The Akashic records and diving into past lives because I was asking about past lives when I was in that five minutes going to sleep I was like talking to my grandpa and then asking

about past lives and I’d get flashes of past lives I was like okay interesting but I didn’t know how to further go into that so I learned about the Akashic records and that really opened a big door for me and the Akashic records are It is a non-physical dimension that holds the information of the

universe.

Your soul has all the lives you’ve lived, all your energy.

Leanne – 20:55

and there’s like a little section that’s just for you and there’s a section for every soul and there’s a section for all the planets and all the things it’s just a giant library of information and you have access to yours all the time and you do have access to yours so every time you’re doing

something like if you’ve ever done something and brand new but it comes easy It’s because you’ve had it in another life and it’s been sent in and you can do it.

It’s just the connection you have to your soul feels like it just… I keep saying it’s just that, sorry.

Avery – 21:27

Yeah, all good.

So what would somebody get from that?

Like why would somebody want to know how to access their Akashic records?

Leanne – 21:37

For me, I had questions about who I was, where I came from, what I’ve done before, what things I’ve had challenges with and I kind of went in more of a direction of what were my struggles, my challenges, my traumas in the past life that are affecting me now and how can I heal that, how can I work

through that, how can I If you’re like completing the cycle, complete the loop so that I can move on without that weight dragging me down.

Because I’ve been pulling that with me, can I make my load lighter?

Can I make my load easier?

So through the Akashic records, I learned how to access information and then I’m also a Reiki master, so I use that information plus When I’m in a cache of records, I can ask the guides and the soul I’m working with in my soul what type of healings or what kind of techniques I can use to help

lighten the load or move forward and the techniques that the person can Mhmm, I agree, I agree.

Avery – 23:15

Alright, so tell me then if people are listening to that and they’re like, oh, that sounds good.

So where would they need to go?

How could they get in touch with you?

Leanne – 23:23

So my website is spruceenergyhealing.com.

On Instagram and Facebook, I’m Spruce Energy Healing.

I’m also on YouTube, Spruce Energy Healing, like I kind of put all my stuff in all of it.

Brilliant.

Yeah, yeah.

And on my website, there’s a booking link.

You go through the work with me tab and you can see my offerings.

Leanne – 23:47

And I also have a podcast, Life of a Lightworker, and That for me was a huge healing experience which I am so proud of myself for doing because I didn’t want to talk, I didn’t want to be seen, I didn’t want to be heard and that really pushed me out of my comfort zone and I’m so glad I did it because

things that were scary aren’t scary anymore.

So every time something scary happens, I’m like, it’s not going to be scary after I do it a few times.

And so you have that more confidence, the more scary things to do, the more scary things you’re willing to do.

Avery – 24:28

Oh, beautifully said.

We’re gonna definitely have that be the like feature quote of this episode.

Leanne – 24:33

Beautiful.

Avery – 24:34

Lovely.

Oh, wonderful.

Beautiful.

All right, love.

So before I let you go, if you had one piece of advice for somebody that’s experiencing burnout or pre burnout right now, what would you tell them?

Leanne – 24:50

I would say it’s okay.

You don’t you don’t need to Not be where you are.

Where you are is perfect.

Where you are is where you’re meant to be and stop trying to get out of it and start trying to try to be in it.

Be yourself.

Honor the moment you’re in.

Honor that where you are is hard.

Leanne – 25:17

It may suck but it’s not going to last forever and Try to reach out and ask for help because it feels really isolating when you’re in that moment, it feels shameful, it feels like you don’t want to ask for help.

I feel like once you recognize it in yourself then it’s easier to ask for help.

Avery – 25:36

I love all of that.

Thank you so much Leanne.

You’re welcome.

And thank you so much for sharing your story and sharing what’s working and what you do and how you help people.

I think there will just be a lot of people resonating with us today.

So I really appreciate you.

Leanne – 25:51

Thank you so much.

I appreciate you.

Avery – 25:56

Hey, do not press that skip button yet.

Yes, this is the end of the episode, but I still have something else I think you’re really gonna like.

I know you’re already an expert at setting goals that push you out of your comfort zone.

Let’s be real, you’re a high achiever after all.

But how often do you sabotage yourself on the way to achieving those goals?

Perfectionism, procrasti-planning, over-committing, holding yourself to a double standard.

All of these things can sabotage our progress by either slowing it down or making it impossible for us to achieve our goals.

Avery – 26:30

Like we talk about so often on this podcast, awareness of what’s causing the issue is the first step.

So take that first step by going to thetruthaboutburnout.com slash quiz To take our free quiz to discover your self-sabotage style.

And of course, I won’t leave you stuck.

Once you complete the quiz and discover your primary self-sabotage style, I’ll follow up with an email giving you ideas about what to do about it so that it stops holding you back.

Go to thetruthaboutburnout.com to get started.

That’s it for now, until next week.