with Avery Thatcher and Patrice Malloy
In this episode Avery engages in a conversation with Patrice Malloy. Patrice shares her journey of overcoming burnout as a high achiever in the corporate and entrepreneurial worlds. Drawing from her extensive expertise in tax advisory, accounting, and auditing, Patrice discusses the intersection of financial stress and burnout, offering practical strategies for managing money-related stress and cultivating a healthier relationship with finances. You will gain valuable insights into recognizing burnout signs, shifting mindset from scarcity to abundance, and seeking financial empowerment.
Patrice Malloy is a certified QuickBooks and Xero Software Pro Advisor, licensed insurance broker, and financial advisor with over 20 years of experience in tax advisory, accounting, and auditing. Patrice empowers small businesses and startups to increase revenue, make confident financial decisions, and create a legacy of wealth. Her expertise encompasses business structuring, asset management, revenue growth, retirement planning, life insurance, and strategic oversight. With a proven track record of delivering increased profit and reduced tax liabilities, Patrice bridges the gap between business, strategy, and finance, transforming the financial state of businesses. Notable clients and experience include DoD, VA, DHS-CBP, PricewaterhouseCoopers, KPMG, Sprint Nextel, Fannie Mac, Freddie Mac, Keurig/Dr. Pepper, and JP Morgan Chase.
[01:20] Personal Burnout Stories: Patrice opens up about her personal experience with burnout, sharing moments of physical discomfort, irritability, and losing interest in her work. She describes how her high-achiever personality and the responsibilities she carried contributed to her burnout.
[04:39] High Achiever Identity: Patrice acknowledges being a high achiever, detailing the characteristics it brings, like determination and resourcefulness. She reflects on its positive and negative impacts, including the constant pursuit of the “next” level of success.
[09:57] Impact of Financial Stress: The discussion shifts to the relationship between financial stress and overall well-being. Patrice discusses how financial struggles can lead to emotional, physical, and productivity challenges.
[11:07] Empowerment through Awareness: Patrice emphasizes the importance of being mindful of one’s financial situation and suggests regular assessment of spending habits to make more informed decisions.
[13:51] Seeking Professional Guidance: Patrice encourages listeners not to feel shame about their financial literacy gaps and instead reach out to experts for guidance and education.
[16:21] Balancing Burnout and Achievement: Strategies for recognizing signs of burnout include listening to one’s body, practicing self-care, and reframing success to incorporate grace and self-compassion.
Links mentioned in this episode:
LinkedIn: Patrice J. Malloy
Avery – 00:00
Money is a significant contributor to our stress, but I think a lot of us know maybe that money needs to be looked at or addressed or that we need to change something, but we’re not really sure how to fix it.
And also, we don’t know how to lower the impact that financial stress has on our nervous system.
In today’s episode with Patrice Malloy, we dig into all of this, including her own unique burnout stories as well.
Hi, I’m Avery Thatcher, and I believe that we can’t solve a problem with the same mindset that created it.
That’s why on this podcast, we combine ancient, Vedic, and Taoist wisdom with our modern lifestyle and latest research to show high achievers like you, how to recover your energy and optimize your habits so you can elevate your impact, and prevent an epic burnout experience.
Because burnouts a bitch in hindsight’s an asshole, so rather than let them win, let’s dig into the truth about burnout.
All right friends, I am very excited to have this conversation here with Patrice today because she talks about something that I think all of us logically know contributes to our stress, but we don’t always know how to fix it.
Avery – 01:20
So welcome Patrice, I’m really excited for you to be here.
Patrice – 01:23
Thank you, I’m excited to be here as well.
Avery – 01:26
So why don’t you tell us a little bit about you and your burnout stories, sort of where that started for you?
Patrice – 01:33
Oh my gosh, so I’ve had a couple of burnout stories quite honestly, so just a little bit about me.
I am an accountant by trade and by profession, and I’m currently a fractional CFO and a tax strategist, so my focus is to empower female founders, entrepreneurs, and high-income earners to master the money and navigate the IRS tax code so that they can build on apologetic wealth and create a
And it wasn’t always like this.
I can definitely say that.
I’ve had a fairly long corporate background.
We’re glad that time I was in the C-suite.
Patrice – 02:11
So just that in and of itself is stressful, as I’m sure you can imagine.
One of the, I’d say, most kind of memorable burnout situations that I had was when I was working on a project that was like a multi-year project.
And I did not necessarily occur to me at the time, but I was noticing that I was having really bad headaches.
I was just irritable.
I did not want to show up for work.
I had lost interest in what it was that I was doing.
Sleeping was an issue.
Patrice – 02:42
You could kind of start to feel those physical changes in your body.
Your neck is hurting.
Your muscles are sore.
You’re not eating well.
I had to basically take time away from my job.
In order to kind of heal myself and get back to a place where I felt, you know, normal.
So that was one of the things that I definitely, like I knew my body was telling me something, but because I think of my personality and just the responsibilities that I had on my plate, I just could not stop.
Avery – 03:36
Yes, so tell me a little bit more about that.
So what parts of your personality do you feel help contribute to burnout?
Patrice – 03:46
I am a type A person, I am A. I’m raised in my hand over here, but yep, that’s one.
I am A. I’m going to say reformed.
I know I’m a recovering perfectionist.
It’s just like… Is this like a putter finger down challenge?
I feel like everybody’s going to be putting fingers down.
I just come from a school of like, if you’re going to do a job, do it well.
It’s like, don’t do it at all.
Patrice – 04:12
So I’ve always kind of had that in the back of my mind.
And then especially as women, right, showing up in different spaces.
It’s just you have to just be that much better to fit in with like the basic people, if I’m being honest, right?
So it’s just always this extra push, extra challenge, extra proof type of process that we kind of go through.
We just have to show that we’re supposed to be here and that was my issue.
Avery – 04:39
So when you see those parts of your personality driving you now, what are some of those red flags that Maybe, again, we always talk about hindsight to jerk, so what are the things looking back there?
Could you see that maybe you missed?
Patrice – 04:58
Oh gosh, so definitely where I’m getting into a place where I really can’t focus clearly on what is that I’m doing.
I know I need to take a break.
It’s like, okay, stand up, go grab something, eat, go take a walk, just do something to kind of refresh yourself and get back to a place where you can refocus on what it is that you’re doing and do it well.
That’s definitely one of the things that I look at.
If a headache starts to kind of come on or if I’m starting to feel the tension in the back of my neck, I also know that I need to take a little break.
If I’m not finished with something, I need to just get it to a point where I know I can restart the next day and be okay with leaving something unfinished.
That’s definitely something that I’ve been working on as well, and just realizing that progress is better than perfection, so as long as I’m doing what I’m supposed to do, as long as I’m feeding the children and everybody’s okay.
Patrice – 05:50
Okay, we’ve succeeded today, so just giving myself grace, quite honestly, I think is something that I’ve been working on for sure, and it’s not really something that I did in the past.
Avery – 06:00
And I think you’re in good company with that.
I think that our ability to show ourselves compassion has been trained out of us very young, especially as people that identify as female because we’re supposed to be the nurturers.
So it just makes it so that we are so much more inclined to deprioritize ourselves, so for sure.
There was a couple of things that you said which I just really wanted to state again, and that is progress is more important than perfection.
And that is something which I like if you are listening to this right now, I know you’re probably saying like, yeah, I know, but it’s something for you to really start thinking about also to give yourself grace because really A lot of our habits that are leading to burnout are not our fault.
It’s stuff that we were trained into, it’s stuff that capitalism, neo-colonialism, the patriarchy are all kind of driving for us.
So we have to learn how to work with that rather than have it work against us.
Avery – 07:03
So tell me for you Patrice, what things, besides like taking that time off of work, what things helped you recover from burnout?
Patrice – 07:11
It’s been a time my family, letting them know what’s been going on, being able to decompress and talk things through, making sure that it wasn’t crazy, but that I wasn’t taking on more than was possible in a set period of time.
I’m just being honest with myself, saying I’m not feeling good and it has to be for a reason.
So really just unpacking what it is that was causing those shifts in mood, not feeling well, the fluctuations in eating habits and sleeping and all of those things.
I just had to really be honest with myself and say it’s this job.
It’s the rate at which I’m moving, it’s the way that I’m pushing myself and I have to stop so that I’m able to function.
You know, absolutely.
Avery – 08:00
So now, do you still identify as a high achiever, even though you’ve kind of healed from that part of Burnup?
Patrice – 08:07
I’m so definitely a high achiever.
I do have goals and things that I am still, you know, reaching towards and dead mind to things of that nature.
But I also realize that the people that you work with and that you collaborate with and connect with are not necessarily focused on your perfection either.
It’s like, do we get the job done?
You know, did we come in on budget?
Did we come in on time?
Like those types of things.
Patrice – 08:31
So they, I think that’s something I kind of put on myself that, like, that made it projected.
But other people are expecting this to me so I know that I have to get this done.
And so just reading myself of those expectations quite honestly is something that I think has been very helpful.
Avery – 08:46
Yes, that’s so powerful.
And I just wanted to highlight that because I kind of had a feeling I knew the answer to that question because I think once we start thinking about like healing the burnout and working through some of those patterns and the habits and pushing ourselves so hard, we’re worried that means that
we’re now going to be this lazy potato that just sits there and does nothing.
And it is not that way at all.
You can still be super driven, but the thing is you’ll actually be able to maintain that.
As you mentioned, it wasn’t like you’ve only burnt out once.
It’s this vicious circle.
Avery – 09:24
We’ve talked about before too, it’s actually not a cycle, it’s more of a wave that we never really come back up to that full performance again until we really learn how to heal that.
So I would love for you to share a little bit more about financial stress and how that impacts us beyond just the financial situation, because we all know that we’re not a being that lives in little silos and compartments.
Everything kind of spills into each other.
So what is your experience working with people that experience that financial stress?
Patrice – 09:57
Oh my goodness, that’s such a great point and I’m glad that you brought that up.
I say the gamut of emotions, of situations, you know, unfortunately, money or the lack thereof is a result of a lot of breakup sub relationships, partnerships as far as businesses go.
You know, not taking care of yourself physically and emotionally because you’re stressed all the time over where the next paycheck is going to come and those situations where there’s more month and money, it’s a vicious cycle like you mentioned with the burnout piece.
It’s just, we feel like there’s just never enough.
And then I think that when we kind of operate from that place of scarcity, I suppose to maybe abundance and saying, you know, I have more than I need, I’m always going to be able to replenish my bake account.
People are stressed, they’re becoming ill, unfortunately, and they’re not able to produce at the level that they would like to or that they achieve to because there’s something that’s always kind of in the back of their mind that’s keeping them from being able to achieve what they’re looking to
Patrice – 11:00
And so when I connect with clients, one of the first things we talk about is kind of like that mindset and understanding and unpacking your money story.
Avery – 11:07
someone is listening to this right now, finances are a huge weight on my shoulder right now.
What first step would you encourage them to take?
Patrice – 11:37
One of the first things I would absolutely say is to pay attention to your bank accounts each and every month.
Even if it’s if you have a money meeting with yourself or your spouse or your family or whoever, once a week or twice a week, it’s very important to understand where you are.
Where are there areas where there might be waste?
Where can we cut back?
What is it that we’re really spending our money on?
Is it something that’s Pay dividends, quite honestly, because if it’s something that’s frivolous, which there’s nothing wrong with that every now and again, Maybe that’s an area where we need to cut back or maybe rethink our spending.
So I think that’s one of the first things to do is really get intimate with your money, have a relationship with your money in your bank account and understand what you can and cannot realistically accomplish within a month.
Patrice – 12:27
And I think once we start getting realistic about that instead of comparing ourselves to other people and then trying to shoot for things that may be outside of our reach at this time, It’s better to really just be realistic with what we have, work with what we’ve got, and utilize those resources to
the best of our abilities.
Avery – 12:44
I love that.
Awareness is always the first step and we can’t fix or do something about something which we’re not seeing at all.
Yeah, that’s really helpful, Patrice.
Thank you so much for that.
So if anybody’s listening and they want to know how to get in contact with you, where would you send them?
Patrice – 13:03
I definitely send them to my website, www.themalloygroupinc.com.
I can also be reached on social media, Instagram, at your favourite tax strategist, and on LinkedIn, at Patrice J. Malloy.
So either one of those platforms is a great place to connect with me.
I’m looking forward to speaking with you all and learning how I can support you.
Avery – 13:29
Patrice – 13:31
And I thank you for allowing me to share that information.
Avery – 13:33
Of course, yes, and we’ll link to all of those things in the show notes as well.
So now one quick question.
I know you do taxes for people in the US.
Is there other things that you offer to people that would be applicable regardless of where you are in the world?
Or is it very much US-focused?
Patrice – 13:51
So regardless of where you’re on the world, so bookkeeping for wherever you are, if it’s pounds, euros, whatever, we can still work on bookkeeping for you for your business.
Or individually, if you’re looking to identify what you’re spending your money on again and see it and plain black and white, you can do that for you.
We also do tax planning and strategies.
So for those of you who may have been impacted by a surprise tax bill or you’re looking for ways to maybe shift your money so that you’re not paying more than you owe, we absolutely do that as well.
And coaching and consulting.
Avery – 14:21
Because we do have a wide listener base, so for those of you that are not listening in the US, then you definitely can still reach out to Patrice.
Thank you so much, Patrice.
This was so wonderful.
And I wish that people listening could see your beautiful smile because it’s just this entire time.
She’s just been such a light.
Avery – 14:41
And I’m sure you can hear it in her voice too.
So, if there’s one thing that you would love for the person listening right now to know, what would that be?
Patrice – 14:51
I would say, are we talking about just burnout in general or are we talking about finances?
What are we talking about here?
Avery – 14:57
So, let’s go one for each.
I’ll put you on the spot, so take your time if you need.
Patrice – 15:03
So for talking burnout, I would definitely say listen to your body.
Your body is such a great, intune, accurate indicator of what is happening in life.
It’s telling you what it needs to do or what it doesn’t need to do, so I’d highly recommend to listen to your body to avoid that burnout or to at least to minimize some of the things that you’re feeling.
In regard to the finances, I would definitely say that Shame is something that I think has impacted people for a long time.
And I think unnecessarily so.
We’re not taught a lot of the times how to manage money, how to manage our finances, how to operate in the real world, quite honestly.
Patrice – 15:45
And that’s where I think a lot of people find challenges and kind of get themselves into trouble.
So I would definitely say that it is okay not to know what you don’t know, but if you have the opportunity to connect with somebody who can educate and power you, I’d highly recommend doing that.
Avery – 16:00
Both beautiful messages.
And I think that bit that you shared about burnout, I think probably about 80% of our guests use that one as well.
So if you have not been listening to your body, here’s your sign.
Here’s your sign.
Well, thank you so much, Patrice.
Again, this was so wonderful, so insightful.
Avery – 16:21
Thank you for being vulnerable and sharing your experiences with us.
And yes, I really look forward to collaborating with you more soon.
Patrice – 16:27
Yes, thank you so much for having me.
I really appreciate it.
Avery – 16:32
Thank you so much for listening, I really hope you found this episode helpful, validating, and maybe you even got a few ideas to try yourself.
If you did enjoy this episode, I just ask that you share it with someone that you think might also benefit from listening to this podcast.
In doing this, you’re not only helping those that you love, you’re also helping me get this podcast into the hands of more people.
Together, we can really make a difference.
And before I let you go, do you know your default self-sabotage style?
There are four main self-sabotage styles that ultimately lead to burnout, and knowing yours can make a really big difference in your ability to prevent burnout from taking over.
Awareness is the first step and the second step.
Avery – 17:16
What you can do with this awareness of your default self-sabotage style I will send you some ideas for what that second step could be after you complete your quiz results.
So are you ready for this quick quiz?
Go to becomingavory.com slash quiz to try it out for yourself and take the first step on your intentional burnout recovery journey.
Becomingavory.com slash quiz for that self-sabotage style assessment.
That’s it for now.
See you next week.